Esterdi
Gambler #24
175 Poker Chips
Posts: 24
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Post by Esterdi on Jun 21, 2012 17:29:47 GMT
And can we ask for any amount of yen for play?
Hope asking here will not disrupt anything, after I am answered positively I may immediately replace this first post with a game.
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Post by Alydar on Jun 21, 2012 17:49:14 GMT
Anyone may propose a game. You may suggest a signup fee, but unless a dealer is dealing it (i.e. you're not dealing it), there can be no transfer of yen for the game. As a general rule, 5 Poker Chips is a standard signup fee for a minigame, and it would end up being approximately zero-sum, meaning the winner (or total payout if multiple people would winner money) would be approximately 5 Poker Chips per player.
If there is no signup fee, the game (if picked up by a dealer) may have a prize of 5 Poker Chips for the winner(s). Generally, this is how the minigames have been played, but the prize or signup fee could potentially be more, as long as the dealer approves and it's not potentially game-breaking (the full games are supposed to let you win (or lose) a lot, not the minigames).
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Esterdi
Gambler #24
175 Poker Chips
Posts: 24
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Post by Esterdi on Jun 22, 2012 9:25:28 GMT
Oh I see. Thanks for mentioning! Well the game I had in mind was pretty straightforward actually. It's called Elusive Shareholders, and here it is explained:
Entry tax of 5 Poker Chips. It would require any even number of people between 6 and 12 to enter. After they're all in, they will be randomly separated into 2 groups. There will be 7 rounds of game play. The game is point-based, and everyone begins with 0 points.
Every round, each player will have to privately tell the dealer whether they want to Pass it or Risk it. Every player is paired with someone from the opposing team at random, and their choice determines the outcome thusly:
Pass is...pass.
If one says risk and one pass, the one risking receives his bet.
If both risk different amounts, the one risking LESS receives the difference and the one risking more loses an amount equal to half what he risked rounded up.
If both risk the same amount, both lose that amount.
A player is forced to Pass at least 2 of the 7 rounds, and Risk 2 of the 7 rounds. If a player risked 5 times in a row, the dealer automatically assumes Pass for him until the game ends (and vice-versa).
A rather interesting twist of the game happens when EVERYONE within a team happens to choose either Risk or Pass. If everyone chooses Pass, they are all treated as if they had sent Risk 5. If everyone chooses Risk, they all simply lose 5 each and the Risk is not rolled.
Scores are NOT public. Here's how the game pans out: right after rounds 2 and 6, the dealer will tell which team has a higher point total (calculated by adding up the total number of points of everyone in the team). He will not state the point total of the teams, or how large the difference is, but simply which team has more points.
After the game is completely finished, the scores and choices of every individual player are revealed, and the team with the highest point total is regarded as the winner. Now here is how the prizes are set:
1. Every player with positive nonzero score (1+ points), regardless if he was on the winning or losing team, will receive 5 Poker Chips. 2. The player on the winning team with the most points will receive 5 Poker Chips for every player that failed to achieve a positive nonzero score until the end of the game. If both teams has the same score the player with the highest score in the game wins. If the winning team has two or more people with the same highest score, they split the winnings. In the rare occurrence that all players have a positive nonzero score, this player will simply be awarded 5 Poker Chips. In the even rarer occurrence that all players have a positive nonzero score, and there are two players on the winning team with the same highest score, they both receive 5 Poker Chips.
Rule of Betrayal: if you believe you are the highest scoring player in the game, but you know your team is on a losing streak, you may private message the dealer with your choice to Betray. If you do this, you will be treated as the winner if your team loses, and the loser if your team wins. You may only betray once.
Rule of Suspicion: if you believe someone betrays, you may private message the dealer with his name. You may only do this for a single player the entire game. If the target did indeed betray (it doesn't matter on whose team he is or you are) AND manages to be the highest scoring player in the winning team, after the game ends he will receive 5 less Poker Chips, which will be instead granted to you. However, if there are more Suspicions on a player than he earns (i.e. 4 people suspect him but he only wins 15 Poker Chips), then the chips are given on a first come first served basis (the 4th suspecter gets nada).
So these are all the rules. Would you like me to write up a sample game?
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Post by 10k on Jun 22, 2012 16:07:22 GMT
People playing LGs tend to be uncomfortable with luck-anything, and I can see a lot of potential for it.
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Post by Iain7 on Jun 22, 2012 18:48:26 GMT
Perhaps rather than luck, the winning team is the one which bets more yen than the other? Or something?
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Esterdi
Gambler #24
175 Poker Chips
Posts: 24
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Post by Esterdi on Jun 22, 2012 20:09:45 GMT
Luck plays only somewhat of a part. Pretty much people reading is involved, but depends on your play.
I WILL think hard about how to make it nonrandom though, would be worth it.
Edit: Oh, I KNOW I KNOW. Why don't we also secretly pair every player in one team with every player in the other, and here's how it goes:
Pass is...pass.
If one says risk and one pass, the one risking receives his bet.
If both risk different amounts, the one risking LESS receives the difference and the one risking more loses an amount equal to half what he risked rounded up.
If both risk the same amount, both lose that amount.
"If everyone on your team Risks everyone simply loses 5 points" still remains, and "If everyone passes everyone Risks 5" still remain unchanged.
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Post by 10k on Jun 22, 2012 21:42:31 GMT
Perhaps you would also like to add a non-random mechanism for pairing players, too?
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Esterdi
Gambler #24
175 Poker Chips
Posts: 24
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Post by Esterdi on Jun 23, 2012 5:33:25 GMT
Perhaps you would also like to add a non-random mechanism for pairing players, too? If I did that, they wouldn't be using psychology and mafia-like logic to figure out who their partner is, now would they? And anyway, the expectancy is that anyone entering the game is doing it with the intent to win, so stuff like "it's unfair that you paired me with such a strong opponent" is hypocritical.
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Post by 10k on Jun 23, 2012 8:41:09 GMT
*Scratched Out* I posted this part of the reply before I realized certain things. Turns out it would make things worse. Go ahead and keep the pairings random, it does an awesome job nerfing alliances.
Some questions: 1. Am I informed about the results of my own decision? Because I happen to find that good to know. 2. What happens when we have a tie regarding the winning team? 3. What happens if NOBODY is positive score? Say, we all do Risk-5 for the 5 rounds we're allowed.
Also, I don't mean to belittle or hate on your game, but at "first" glance it appears to be -EV with both sides playing the optimal strategy based on the current rules (so far as I can tell, but I'm still crunching numbers). I might make another post when I figure it out. I think you may have picked up on it too based on a couple of your rules, and then went ahead to try and mitigate what I have in mind.
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Esterdi
Gambler #24
175 Poker Chips
Posts: 24
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Post by Esterdi on Jun 23, 2012 10:43:43 GMT
1. Am I informed about the results of my own decision? Because I happen to find that good to know.
You know your score and nothing more. Using that info you COULD deduce your results.
2. What happens when we have a tie regarding the winning team?
That is a very good question! I should probably write it in the rules.
If the teams tie the player with the highest score overall wins.
3. What happens if NOBODY is positive score? Say, we all do Risk-5 for the 5 rounds we're allowed.
Then the maximum prize is reached. If there are 12 players, and NONE have a positive score, then the winner receives 12*5 Poker Chips.
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Post by 10k on Jun 23, 2012 19:48:41 GMT
Alright, I've spent enough time analyzing this game on its current mechanics. I won't explain my findings here, but I can summarize this game as strategy rock-paper-scissors. I'm not saying that's bad or anything like that. Rather, it could be an opportunity to do a little profiling on other players.
By the way, is the NAME of the player stated from round 4's score announcement? Either way, that particular rule has the potential to give an unfair advantage. I'd feel more comfortable if it conformed to rounds 2 and 6.
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Esterdi
Gambler #24
175 Poker Chips
Posts: 24
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Post by Esterdi on Jun 23, 2012 20:33:43 GMT
Nah, it was a stupid idea. I'll it altogether.
Don't really know what was going through my mind when I proposed that.
EDIT: modified my initial posts to portray the changes to the game. Namely, addition of nonrandom scoring and removal of the player reveal.
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Post by 10k on Jun 24, 2012 5:01:04 GMT
If the rules remain as they are, I will join.
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Post by Alydar on Jul 4, 2012 12:49:17 GMT
I've yet to read over everything fully, but it seems good at first glance. I'll probably pick this up, but wait a little while I catch up with my life after being away from everything for 2 weeks... And first things first, I need to make final changes to the next games that will be out shortly. However, if people want to sign up for this (and other minigames that were almost ready to be played), please do.
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Esterdi
Gambler #24
175 Poker Chips
Posts: 24
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Post by Esterdi on Jul 20, 2012 16:26:16 GMT
Awesome. Thanks.
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